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Baldev
Registered Member

Date Joined Sep 2004
Total Posts : 1

Posted 9/14/2004 5:15 PM (GMT -5)

I am a great believer in coQ10 and i would like to be referred to positive research done on this subject, especially whether it helps autoimune (Type 1) diabetics.

Baldev

Post Edited By Moderator (DDye) : 9/6/2005 12:31:02 PM (GMT-4)

ot03
Registered Member

Date Joined Mar 2005
Total Posts : 63

Posted 5/2/2005 1:25 PM (GMT -5)

I have heard that in high enough doses coq10 can do all sorts of things including: killing tapeworms and parasites that other methods can't .. . diabetes supposedly being the result of the pancreatic fluke ... the dosage has to be 2000-3000 of >good< coq10 though.

jimmyboy
Registered Member

Date Joined Sep 2005
Total Posts : 6

Posted 9/6/2005 12:30 PM (GMT -5)

I took CoQ10 for a few weeks, and, suddenly, for the first time in my life, I was suffering from strangulated hemorrhoids. This type of disorder is caused by tiny blood clots in the anal veins, which prevent the flow of blood, and cause intense pain. It was one of the most painful experiences in my life, but, thankfully, just as I was about to go under the ass-surgeon's knife, I discovered the benefits of bromelain, which dissolved the clots away after a few days of taking 500 mg 3x per day. I did not associate the hemorrhoids with CoQ10, at that time, but, because of the pain and problems, I was distracted from my supplement regimen, and stopped taking it.

Several months later, I "rediscovered" my bottle of CoQ10, and started taking it again. Within 3 days, I started suffering from the first signs of blood clots, in the form of strangulated hermorrhoids. This time, however, I knew the cure, and reached for my bottle of bromelain, right away. The incident passed, and I began to wonder if it had something to do with the CoQ10.

I started to intensively research the issue. Apparently, CoQ10 is structurally very similar to vitamin K. Chemically, one can be substituted for the other in the bodies of some people. A few stray scientific papers record various incidents in which CoQ10 has caused blood clots. It has also recorded the fact that it has also thinned the blood, by interfering with the action of vitamin k, blocking its access to the k receptor. I suspect that the determination of whether it will give you blood clotting, or blood thinning effect, is written in your genes.

Bottom line, however, CoQ10 is a very dangerous supplement to be fooling around with, and should not be taken without careful monitoring. And, this requires actual clotting tests...the expensive time-consuming kind...rather than the abbreviated testing they do for warfarin patients. The best course of action is to avoid CoQ10. I had the blood clots in my ass, and they have a hard time flowing out of there, because of the nature of how the human body is constructed. If I had continued taking this supplement, clots might have eventually formed in my lower legs, and been carried to the heart and lungs, where I could have suffered a heart attack, and died, or, at least, suffered severe aftereffects.

In short, my best advice, based on experience, is that, until it can be determined whose blood will clot and whose blood will thin, in reaction to CoQ10, if you value your life, AVOID THIS SUPPLEMENT LIKE THE PLAGUE!!!

leppert
Registered Member

Date Joined Nov 2001
Total Posts : 537

Posted 9/7/2005 12:50 PM (GMT -5)

jimmyboy, what a strange tale. We have been using Q10 successfully for many years. My DR even had me taking 400 mg after extensive dental surgery. What brand of Q10 were you using? Could it have been contaminated? We use the LEF brand. I also take their Super K vitamin daily.

zorba990
Registered Member

Date Joined Jul 2004
Total Posts : 710

Posted 9/7/2005 8:11 PM (GMT -5)

Never heard of this, and I find it highly unlikely to have been caused by CoQ10.

Much more likely the supplement was contaminated and should be sent to a lab for analysis.

BTW I have been taking CoQ10 continuously since 1984 without any such issues.
30 mg for about 10 years then 100 mg until about 3 years ago then 400 mg dry then
300 mg dissolved in oil.

Metabolisms can be unique, perhaps you have a CoQ10 metabolic disorder.
But I doubt it ...

CB
Registered Member

Date Joined Aug 2005
Total Posts : 44

Posted 9/9/2005 12:44 PM (GMT -5)

Baldev,

To get back to your original question...some mentions of diabetes and CoQ10 are:

from http://www.pdrhealth.com/drug_info/nmdrugprofiles/nutsupdrugs/coe_0084.shtml

"Clinical reports from Japan suggest that supplemental CoQ10 may improve beta-cell function and glycemic control in type II diabetics. CoQ10 does not appear to improve glycemic control in type I diabetics. Diabetics should be made aware of this possibility, and those diabetics who do use supplemental CoQ10 should determine by appropriate monitoring if they need to make any adjustments in their diabetic medications."

Also, from http://www.defeatdiabetes.org/Articles/supplements2021206.htm

"New study findings indicate that treatment with coenzyme Q10 (CoQ) may help adults with type 2 diabetes to stabilize blood glucose levels and lower their blood pressure."

And, from http://www.diabetes123.com/clinic/alternative_coq10.htm

CoQ10 is a vitamin-like substance with a structure similar to vitamin K. In diabetes it is theorized that using CoQ10 may enhance activity of certain enzymes and may stimulate insulin secretion. It has been studied for a variety of cardiovascular disorders. It may produce GI upset, insomnia, and rare increases in liver enzymes. There are a variety of drug interactions including decreased bleeding time with warfarin use, possible attenuation of the antihypertensive effect of beta blockers and decreased endogenous CoQ10 with statin use. On the other hand, CoQ10 may lessen the toxicity of the chemotherapeutic agent, doxorubicin. In studies involving both type 1 and 2 diabetes, CoQ10 has shown variable effects on diabetes endpoints.

I've taken it for years mostly for its cardioprotective effects, and without any problems.

CB

jimmyboy
Registered Member

Date Joined Sep 2005
Total Posts : 6

Posted 10/7/2005 1:34 PM (GMT -5)

To further support the proposition that it has nothing to do with the brand, or whether it is LEF brand or someone else's brand ... here is what it says, on Dr. Lam's natural medicine web site, in an article on "Hypercoagulation" (also known as excessive blood clotting) which can be found at http://www.drlam.com/opinion/blood_thinners_and_nutritional_supplement.cfm

"...Coenzyme Q10 (coQ10) is a compound made naturally in the human body, plant and animals. This compound is involved in electron transport and may be a free-radical scavenger, an antioxidant and a potent membrane stabilizer. CoQ10 is highly reputed for treating heart disease patients. It can also help to stabilize high blood pressure and angina.

The structure of CoQ10 is very similar to that of vitamin K2. As such, it may have blood-coagulating effects. The vitamin K-like effects of CoQ10 have since been demonstrated in a laboratory setting and in the following reports:

http://www.drlam.com/opinion/blood_thinners_and_nutritional_supplement.cfm

jimmyboy
Registered Member

Date Joined Sep 2005
Total Posts : 6

Posted 10/7/2005 1:36 PM (GMT -5)

I actually used two brands of CoQ10, and both had the same blood clot inducing effect. I think that one brand was KAL, and the other was Solgar, I believe, but I am not sure. In any event, it is not the brand that matters. It is the substance itself. Apparently, it is a vitamin K analog, which can be substituted by some people's bodies for vitamin K, and it can have vitamin K activity, causing blood clots. For most people, however, it is a blood thinner, because their bodies cannot use it as a substitute. Perhaps, this has to do with blood type, but, right now, the determination of when and exactly why it will act as a clotting agent, and when it will act as a thinning agent, is completely unknown. Perhaps, it is best said by the warnings section of Intellihealth (http://www.intelihealth.com/IH/ihtIH/WSIHW000/8513/31402/350469.html?d=dmtContent#dangers ) which, in referencing what are obviously the studies I saw after experiencing the blood clots, states,

"... In theory, coenzyme Q10 may increase the risk of blood clots. In contrast, coenzyme Q10 may also theoretically increase the risk of bleeding in some people, based on one report that coenzyme Q10 has effects on components of the blood that are involved with forming blood clots. If you have a blood clotting disorder or a history of blood clots or if you use anticoagulants (blood thinners) or antiplatelet drugs such as warfarin (Coumadin), heparin or clopidogrel (Plavix), speak with your health care provider before using coenzyme Q10..."

jeffnvegas
Registered Member

Date Joined Jan 2006
Total Posts : 8

Posted 1/5/2006 3:35 PM (GMT -5)

great!!!
i have a related question in another topic which concerns my warfarin use and acceptable supplements. this is the first time i ever saw anything definitive relating to COQ. anyone have some up to date links relating to this????
thanks, this could have saved my life!

Health Ctr.
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2005
Total Posts : 56

Posted 1/5/2006 11:15 PM (GMT -5)

With Harvard Medical School accepting pharmaceutical money I don't put a lot of faith in them anymore, especially when its based on theory & on one study. No clinical studies. Also you are not sure what brand of CoQ10 you used. So you don't know if the CoQ10 came from China or Japan or if it was the other ingredents that you had a reaction to. I have been takinmg CoQ10 since 1983 & have a lot of clients taking it that have COPD with no problem. People are not deficient in a rat posion (Warfarin). Long Life & Happiness

rizwan
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2005
Total Posts : 142

Posted 1/6/2006 12:50 PM (GMT -5)

I too have been taking coenzyme Q10 200 to 300 mg per day for last 5 years without any problems and with good benefits. Also I am aware of others taking it and getting benefits.

Maybe it's something very specific to your genes if it's not the brand.

The rule is the same for everything: if it does not agree with you, don't take it.

Adaptogenic
Registered Member

Date Joined Aug 2005
Total Posts : 7

Posted 1/11/2006 11:05 AM (GMT -5)

I've been taking 120 mg of CoQ10 daily for over 10 years with no problems whatsoever.

jg7
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2005
Total Posts : 9

Posted 1/11/2006 3:41 PM (GMT -5)

I disagree with the statement that the brand does not matter. It DOES matter. Every manufacturer has a different process and some use inferior substances to make to product. That is why I use LEF supplements exclusively. I take CoQ10, my husband takes it and my mother who eliminated her arrhythmia for the last seven years takes 100 mg daily with no problems. I trust LEF research first and foremost. I don't trust mainstream medical doctors so I would never ask their opinion on any supplement, only a holistic doc.

Health Ctr.
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2005
Total Posts : 56

Posted 1/13/2006 11:35 AM (GMT -5)

You are right jg7, which brand does matter. I preferred the old CoQ10 formulation to the new one. I do not take the new one or sell this because of ethyl oleate (ethyl ester) a synthetic chemical (solvent) (look it up). Also because of polysorbate 80. Go to Professor Samuel Epstein M.D.'s website (www.preventcancer.com ) click on search and type in polysorbate 80. Long Life & Happiness

jg7
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2005
Total Posts : 9

Posted 1/13/2006 1:35 PM (GMT -5)

I have not purchased the new formula yet. Why did they change the formulation? Anyone from LEF know?

- Most of LEF's supplements are modified when new data and/or improved materials are available. - moderator

zorba990
Registered Member

Date Joined Jul 2004
Total Posts : 710

Posted 1/14/2006 11:32 AM (GMT -5)

Honestly if you look at the new capsule, the CoQ10 is not even dissolved in the orange oil (Limonene). They look fully separated and that doesn't seem like it would have the effect you are going for (fat dissolved substance entering the lymph system like many of the new dissolved gelcap medicines).

It appears that the manufacture has skipped the mixing process and somehow assumed that the substances would dissolve by osmosis or something. Or they were never mixed well in the first place. Orange oil seems to be a great solvent for oil, but CoQ10 is not naturally an oil.

In any case, I would suggest (again) that you look into the Lutimax Syn process...

- The coQ10 in the soft gel capsules is semisolid at room temperature. Try rolling the capsule in your hand and you will see what appears to you to be undissolved liquefy. - moderator

KarinR
Registered Member

Date Joined Aug 2004
Total Posts : 26

Posted 1/19/2006 1:22 PM (GMT -5)

As long as we're talking about CoQ10, I'll interject that I like the old formula better, too for the reasons others mentioned, and I don't know what I'll do when I run out. I loaded up on the old stuff when they went on a discontinuation sale and will take the last of it by July or August of this year. I, too, don't want to take the chemicals in the new version.

gertie
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 2007
Total Posts : 2

Posted 6/21/2007 9:32 AM (GMT -5)

Curious about the clotting issue people are talking about in reference to COQ10. The idea that people may metabolize it differently perhaps due to genetics? Has any one heard if this? Could have to do with a genetic condition called Leiden Factor Five clotting disorder which is actually quite common and/or Protein C deficiency which is less common but both of which make people more likely to have clotting issues? Both confirmed by an easy blood test. Anyone have thoughts?

yza
Registered Member

Date Joined Jul 2007
Total Posts : 123

Posted 8/10/2007 10:09 AM (GMT -5)

CoQ10 can act as a blood coagulant. This might be a problem for someone taking a blood thinner such as Coumadin. There have been at least four reported cases where CoQ10 apparently decreased the anticoagulant effects of Coumadin.

If you are taking a blood thinner you should talk to your doctor before taking CoQ10. If warfarin and coenzyme Q10 are to be used together, blood tests to assess clotting time should be monitored frequently, especially in the first two weeks.

Nat30
Registered Member

Date Joined Aug 2009
Total Posts : 2

Posted 8/3/2009 9:13 AM (GMT -5)

What brand is LEF???

I use Enzymatic Therapy for a heart arrhythmia, 200 mg daily. I also happen to have antiphospholipid antibodies so that makes me worry a little if coq10 affects clotting. However the supplement also has vitamin E in it, so I wonder if that would balance it all out? I do know one thing for sure, the coq10 definitely reduces the number of arrhythmia episodes I have.

DDye
Forum Moderator

Date Joined Jan 2002
Total Posts : 361

Posted 8/3/2009 9:15 AM (GMT -5)

If you are asking who the manufacturer of the ubiquinol product is, it is Kaneka.

Confused1
Registered Member

Date Joined Jul 2009
Total Posts : 12

Posted 8/31/2009 7:47 AM (GMT -5)

ConsumerLabs doesn't have any big reservations with CoQ10. I have not heard the negative reports so I will continue taking my 200 mg a day. Johns Hopkins White Paper had nothing negative.

jeffpass
Registered Member

Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 6

Posted 1/5/2010 10:23 AM (GMT -5)

I have been having some recent problems with my toes turning temporarily pale in the cold (one of them almost white), and read up on a phenomenon call Raynaud's. It's what I hope I am experiencing, as it would be the least scary problem.

Anyway a medical textbook I read at an herbal store listed the two vitamin supplements essential to helping with Raynaud's/circulation and possibly curing it are CoQ10 and Vitamin E. It says CoQ10 helps oxygenate the tissues and vitamin E dissolves clots and helps blood flow.

What I would like to know is, if this chemical is also made naturally in the body, will supplementing with CoQ10 eventually end up decreasing your own body's production, so that if you ever stop you will be more deficient than ever before, and basically be "in for it"?

Is it safe to take the supplemement, even if you are not totally sure you need it but hopeful of course it will help? Any thoughts?

DDye
Forum Moderator

Date Joined Jan 2002
Total Posts : 361

Posted 1/5/2010 10:27 AM (GMT -5)

Have not seen any studies indicating a feedback loop for coQ10 when it is supplemented. CoQ10 is safe except for a very small minority of people for whom it can worsen arrhythmias (in most people it sucessfully treats arrhythmia). CoQ10 production declines with age, so supplementing with it makes sense. Vitamin E should not be used in higher doses if you are using blood thinners, have a clotting disorder, or bruise easily. Ask your physician if supplementing with these is right for you.

jeffpass
Registered Member

Date Joined Jan 2010
Total Posts : 6

Posted 1/5/2010 10:29 AM (GMT -5)

Hi All,

I just wanted to relate my experience with co-Q10. I tried it for the first time today with a multivitamin, 600 mg. about three or four hours later I was working around in the house and I felt lightheaded.......like I was going to pass out and my heart was racing. Panicky and hot and compressed, I don't know how else to describe it. I really didn't know what was going on. It got worse and worse. Finally I got my coat and thought about asking the neighbor to take me to the hospital.

I ended up calling my sister who is a registered nurse and she told me by the symptoms I was having a panic attack. I've never had one before. For some reason my reaction was like I had taken a whole bunch of stimulants. It gradually subsided after awhile. Anyway I looked around on the internet and found this woman who experienced the same thing:

http://curezone.com/forums/fm.asp?i=440135#i

What causes this? Surely it is strange that both of us had the same reaction, I don't even know the woman in the article and it happened to her like 7 years ago.
I'm intrigued that some people have taken this for years without symptoms like this and was hoping it would help me.

Are some people unable to take this? Maybe it reacted with some other vitamin or mineral? I took a StressTab Advanced which had a whole page of different minerals so I have no idea which one if that is the case.

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